Conference Realignment Rumors: Florida State To SEC?
by Brian Favat on Aug 12, 2011 1:55 PM EDT
in Conference Expansion
Email
PrintAccording to a report in the Palm Beach Post, the rumors of Florida State becoming the 14th team in the SEC are "real":
"Florida State officials have been flirting with the SEC for several months and the discussion now are getting more serious, according to sources.
Rumors have been spreading that the SEC is poised to expand, first to 14 teams and then to 16, and the Seminoles and Texas A&M of the Big 12 could be the first two to jump.
"This is real," said a source close to FSU."
Other possible candidates as a 14th SEC include: Clemson, Virginia Tech, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State (settle down there, N.C. State). Also according to the report, it doesn't sound like Miami is going anywhere. So there's that, too.
If Texas A&M actually follows through on joining the SEC as the conference's 13th team, I would imagine the conference would move to 14 and look towards the ACC over other Big 12 options such as Oklahoma, Oklahoma State (which seems to be a package deal) or Missouri. I don't believe the SEC will move to 16 teams right now. ESPN, which has broadcast rights for the SEC, ACC, Big 12 and the Longhorn Network, can't just rip up its existing TV contract with the SEC and has a vested interest in ensuring that all three of those conferences stay together.
Call me crazy, but I actually think the ACC could survive the departure of either Florida State, Clemson or Virginia Tech and stand pat at 11 programs. Everyone sort of freaks out about getting to 12 programs and a football championship game, but that hasn't worked out so well for the ACC, has it? When the ACC moved to the divisional format for the 2005 season, the divisions were divided to set up the possibility of a Florida State vs. Miami title game down in Florida. How's that worked out for us?
Eleven programs wouldn't be all that bad when you think about it. The Big Ten has managed an 11-program conference for nearly two decades after Penn State joined the fold. Losing the ACCCG would also eliminate a hurdle to putting a second team in the big money BCS bowls. Plus we could get rid of the Atlantic and Coastal Divisions which made little sense to begin with. An added bonus would be that BC would get to face those teams in the Coastal Division more often on the gridiron (read: Miami).
On the basketball side, the conference could move to an 18-game regular season, which would give programs home-and-home series with 8 of the 10 other programs in the league. This would be sure to make those Tobacco Road purists happy as it gets the conference closer to the round-robin basketball sched that the conference left behind when it added Miami and Virginia Tech in 2004.
Plus, if we lost a Florida State or a Clemson, this would improve the academic profile of the conference. Addition by subtraction?
Why would the ACC rush to reload with a lesser Big East program -- Syracuse, Connecticut, Pittsburgh, Rutgers -- just to get back to an even dozen when it could conceivably work as an 11 school conference going forward?
50 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
I would be shocked if the SEC took Clemson
There just is no advantage to them, and OU/OSU seem a package deal. While there is no need for the SEC to expand past 14, there is no need to stop at 14 either. If this set off the Pac12 and or the Big10 to expand, they will not stop until they get to 16. It will be interesting either way.
As an SEC guy...
I don’t see us taking Clemson either. And I think once the dominos start falling, it goes past 14 just because other conferences will scramble to keep up. We may see the Big 12 implode and be gobbled up by the PAC 10 minus A&M and the Okie schools, the ACC get raided for FSU to the SEC and the ACC have to merge with the Big East after the Big 10 pulls schools from the Big East. Buckle your seat belt.
WVU actually makes a lot of sense
Solid football program over the long-term, will have a great year now and again but won’t really challenge the SEC’s existing elite. Doesn’t mind a little “if you aren’t cheating you aren’t trying” from its fellow conference members. Won’t raise any academic concerns.
friendly college football lol
http://www.bigeastcoastbias.com/2011/8/5/2347354/big-east-linkage-august-5#74030677
The one where Kid Tenderloin describes WVU as an “ethnic-SEC” school.
And you know West Virginia is been making goo goo eyes at any conference that will even remotely entertain bringing them on …
Editor, BC Interruption
Univ of Florida will not allow this
The gators wan the state all to themselves. Look further north.
Dikaia Upotheke - Justice Our Foundation
Florida by itself cannot successfully veto FSU's inclusion.
I think Team Speed Kills explains it best.
My hatred for Purdue is so great that even I cannot detect it.
But they are both controlled by the same state govenment???
If the State of Florida would like some more $$ (and what state does not want more $$) they will allow FSU to go. U Florida, controlled by the same state government, will have zip to say about it. Let’s not act like the AD of U Florida has more power than the state government.
Trend is to get bigger tho...
First, I completely agree with your thoughts on an 11 team conference if Clemson or FSU is picked up by the SEC. Would like playing more Coastal opponents.
However, I think the ACC would panic and see this as the next trend. First, it was everyone going all gung-ho to get to 12 teams and get the coveted Championship game. Next, a move to 14 teams to expand markets and grow the conference geographically while picking up good athletic programs along the way. Next, 16 team Super-conferences…
Nice idea, but afraid Swoff would panic and try and grab the best of the Big East (Syracuse?)
What makes you think Swofford would panic and act decisively? He has established a clear track record of being extremely reactive when it comes to expansion.
I could very easily see the North Carolina power base lobbying to stay with 11.
Editor, BC Interruption
Maybe panic was the wrong word, but I think college athletic conferences are moving towards football-driven Super-conferences. I think Swofford would want to get Pitt, WVU, and Syracuse (or maybe Yukon) before the Big Ten starts to inquire.
I just think you are giving Swofford too much credit here. Think about how smoothly ACC expansion #1 went (read: not very) and he has repeatedly come out and said he’s taking a reactive approach to all of these musical chairs.
Editor, BC Interruption
FALL OUT -- TCU jilts BE and goes to B12
as a replacement for TAMU. Not fact, but a part of the gossippy speculation of the day by a Houston paper: TCU to Jilt Chumps in BE
Wouldn’t that be schadenfreudenly (is that word?) fascinating
I thought of this too ...
I mean, it would be a shame for the Big East to lose its 2012 football champ before they ever play a game in the conference.
But sounds like Houston is the backup plan.
“Beebe also told Texas A&M that Texas is the school that holds the key to the Big 12’s future, and that as long as the Longhorns don’t leave, the Big 12 would survive. In fact, should Texas A&M leave then the Big 12 may just replace them with Houston.”
Editor, BC Interruption
politics
TCU is a private school and doesn’t have the well-placed alumni that Baylor did while the Big 12 was being formed. If Texas politicians force another school into the Big 12, it will be Houston. But unless forced to take Houston by Texas politics, the best add for the Big 12 (and no one else is even close) would be BYU (even with the difficulties they present). Houston adds no new markets, and doesn’t improve TV ratings either.
Houston might have some value to us the Big East (as TCU doesn’t have a statewide fan base in Texas, and could use a partner there); it does nothing for the Big 12 unless they’re advance planning for Texas’ exit.
with the caveat that I'm a Syracuse fan living in California
and so the fine points of Big 12 internals and Texas politics are very foreign to me, yes, there’s no chance TCU replaces Texas A&M in the Big 12. The Big 12 doesn’t want them (no new markets, good enough at football to be a threat to Texas & Oklahoma), they don’t really want the Big 12 (still bitter over the SWC fallout, and since they’re not Texas or Oklahoma, they’re likely to make more money in the Big East), and no one in the Texas government is likely to try and force them into the Big 12.
ok. so I am just getting some speculation from a BE fan. thought you might be a Texas insider. … guess we will wait and see.
Assuming ACC needs a new member, wouldn’t Syracuse be delighted to join?
No
We’d do it, because the BE is a mess, and some fans would be happy to be in the ACC. And I’d rather be in a 12-team ACC than any super-sized conference. If the BE could grab three Big 12 teams and split from the non-football schools (which becomes possible if a 2nd Big 12 joins the SEC, rather than an ACC team), I’d rather do that than join the ACC.
But if super-conferences break out all over, I’d rather SU be in the Big Ten than the ACC, and if I could blow things up and build them my way, SU’s conference would be mostly made up of current or former Big East schools (and Penn State and a couple others to get to ten — I’m not a big fan of conference).
SU would rather stay in the BE with likes of Kansas St and other cast offs, which for BE purposes are geographic and cultural mismatches, rather than joining the ACC? I find that very, very hard to believe. But maybe it is just your view and not the true SU view
Yeah, I don't buy that either
A Big East football/basketball split hurts Syracuse’s best sport — hoops. Didn’t Boeheim put the kaibosh on the move to the ACC in the first place because of this? Lose in-conference hoops rivalries with Georgetown, Villanova, Notre Dame …
A conference of:
Syracuse
UConn
Rutgers
Pittsburgh
West Virginia
Louisville
Cincinnati
South Florida
Texas Christian
Kansas
Kansas State
Missouri
is better than:
Boston College
Clemson
Duke
Georgia Tech
Maryland
Miami (Florida)
North Carolina
N.C. State
Syracuse
Virginia
Virginia Tech
Wake Forest
To each is own, I guess. But that version of the Big East is just a bad, bad amalgamation of schools that really share little in common other than being historically bad at football.
Editor, BC Interruption
I'd rather be with Pitt and WVU and UConn
… and even Rutgers, who SU has some real history with, rather than actually caring about one game a year like you guys do in the ACC.
Short institutional memory
Fans of the Big East act like the conference has been around since the World Wars wrt “some real history.”
BC has faced Rutgers just 26 times. That’s good for 12th most all-time, behind Holy Cross, Syracuse, Villanova, Temple, Army, West Virginia, Boston U., Navy, Pittsburgh, Fordham and Miami. Of those teams on the list, BC still has regular season series scheduled with Cuse, Army and Miami — and can’t play Holy Cross (Patriot League) and BU (defunct), not can they play Nova or Fordham with any regularity.
Missing “real history” with RU? Nope.
UConn is 24th on that list, with just 4 games happening post-WWII. Behind Clemson, Notre Dame, UMass, Virginia Tech, Wake Forest, Saint Anselm and Marquette.
Membership in the Big East also comes with Cincinnati (36th), Louisville (41st), TCU (110th) and USF, who BC has never faced.
I’m failing to see all this “real history” that BC is missing out on.
Editor, BC Interruption
Syracuse
Cuse has much more “real history” in the Big East than BC does or ever will.
1. Penn State — 70
2. Colgate — 66
2. Pittsburgh — 66
4. West Virginia — 58
5. Boston College — 46
6. Rutgers — 41
7. Temple — 36
8. Cornell — 34
8. Maryland — 34
10. Holy Cross — 28
By the way, Temple in the top 10 for both BC and Cuse. Think the Big East should take another hard look at the Owls … could be great!
Editor, BC Interruption
Syracuse would stick out like a sore thumb in the Big Ten. I say this as a NU grad, the Big Ten’s only private school.
I suppose a part of me would like to see BC in the Big Ten — mainly for hockey and to hang with other northern schools — but really believe the ACC is the best fit for the school. The school desperately wants to be more like UVa, Duke, Wake, Miami and North Carolina.
That’s why I’m not sweating losing FSU or Clemson all that much. Think the ACC could either stay put or add Cuse, who obviously fits the profile of the ACC more than FSU or CU. They were in the original ACC expansion plan, after all.
Editor, BC Interruption
I guess most of my thinking on that
Is that the closest thing to a real, serious football rivalry that SU ever had was with Penn State — which is closer to Syracuse (and half of the Big East) than to any other Big Ten school. And that if the Big Ten expanded, it would likely be adding Notre Dame as well (so three private schools out of 16 instead of 1 out of 12) and probably at least one other eastern school along with SU so while SU would stick out a bit now, they would stick out less in a Big 16. And I don’t doubt that part of my thinking is because I’m an Ohio native; I’d like to see SU playing Ohio State more.
FSU = Clemson, disloyal to ACC and disrespectful to BC
From Tomahawk Nation
FSU athletics should love to bolt from the ACC. FSU is the most important school for the ACC, financially. And yet the ACC insists on scheduling a marquee game (@Clemson) a week after we host the Sooners. And, while arguably forced into it via the ESPN / ACC TV deal, making FSU play a road game a thousand miles away, at night on a Thursday [against BC] with 4 days rest, doesn’t seem like much incentive toward any ACC solidarity on FSU’s part.
Wahhh!
You know who else is facing Florida State on 4 days rest? Boston College.
Don’t let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya, amiright?
Editor, BC Interruption
by Brian Favat on Aug 12, 2011 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions
wahhh?
FSU will do what is best for FSU not for a school that anyone outside of Boston (and from what I hear no one really cares about them in their own city) has even heard of.
FSU will take this offer and go where the real money in the real revenue sport is. I know BC fans cant understand this. Then BC gets to deal with John Swofford, the most incompetent commish in NCAA athletics, and the good ole boy network that is the NCACC. The ACC can focus on what they think is best. Basketball.
Enjoy improving you Accademic Coast Conference. The great thing is now the ACC can drop the totally gay names of each division and call it something like " Never won a BCS title" and “Never gonna win a BCS title”.
Or maybe BC can bolt for the Big Least considering the ACC and their genius leadership thought BC would actually increase viewership and exposure for the ACC in the northeast. How is that workin for ya ACC? BC was mistake number #1 for the ACC.
Dont hate because BC is now irrelevant to any person not an alum.
Swofford: " Yep, we would drop the champeenship game now that FSU and Clemson left for the SEC, but we are afraid to disappoint the Boston College fans who travel so well and represent their school so well."
AB and Dr. Pepper: “Who?”
by LincolnHighNole on Aug 13, 2011 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions
And you wonder why I could care less if Florida State bolts to ACC for third place finishes in the SEC East.
Editor, BC Interruption
Brian
We are 2-0 against the SEC east with Jimbo Fisher.
I was searching for reallignemnet specualtion and you are a visitor to FSU boards. I thought I will look to see your blog and what it says.
But I saw your true colors about how you feel about FSU. It was a mistake for me to come here I guess, but I always liked your comments on TN, and I have visited many times to read about the rumors.
I wont make that mistake again. I never commented on your board until i saw how arrogantly you wrote your story about FSU and them leaving.
Maybe you can do a story about how BC was the first big mistake the ACC made on the way to their demise. Here are some interesting facts for you. You’re welcome for the help.
http://www.southernpigskin.com/acc/view/boston-college-the-accs-biggest-mistake
by LincolnHighNole on Aug 13, 2011 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions
This is some high-quality writing here.
“While the ACC has been beneficial to Boston College, monetary speaking, the relationship has thus far been one sided; it’s evident by the embarrassingly small ACC/ESPN television contract that BC has not captured the populous north-east television viewing market which mostly remains staunchly uninterested in college athletics. It also appears there is not even enough interest amongst their fans to regularly sell out their 44,500 seat capacity Alumni stadium.”
I forgot that BC’s success was the reason “the ACC has been rewarded with low attendance and low television ratings for the two ACC championship games that they were involved in and are part of the reason why the Gator bowl removed all ties to the conference, as well as the relatively small tv contract with ESPN.”
My fault.
Editor, BC Interruption
True or Not?
If it is not true, then you have your next story piece when all the juicy rumors about conference reallignment stop.
BC was brought into the conference mainly to increase the TV viewership and exposure in the North-east. If not true, then why was BC brought into the equasion? FSU was brought into the equasion to make money and win National Championships. We have 2 for the ACC, and we played in the first 3 BCS Championship games representing the ACC winning 1.
Looks like BC has not done what the geniuses in the ACC head office thought they would. 1-sided. Our TV contract horrible and we are stuck with it for 20 years if FSU stays in the ACC.
Its all about the money.
Sorry for making this personal, and I always came here to read the updates you have had regarding the reallignment issue.
Dont worry about the door hitting us on the way out. We will make sure to turn the light off after we leave.
by LincolnHighNole on Aug 13, 2011 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m not going to respond to an article that reads like it was written by a Bleacher Report author, sorry.
We’ll all share a laugh about this when FSU doesn’t get that coveted SEC invite and you’re stuck slummin’ it in the ACC with Boston College and Wake Forest.
Editor, BC Interruption
Don't mistake Tomahawk Nation for Seminole Nation
University presidents don’t have the SEC Envy that certain sports editors do. And they make the decisions. Presidents think of AAU membership and academic possibilities and a few other priorities that rarely preoccupy sports writers.
Plenty of Seminole fans love the ACC and would like to see the conference work. See my proposal below. It completes the expansion left dangling after the Eagles joined the conference and an open geographical hole was placed in the Eastern seaboard.
Abiaka Windclan
>>>----------------------->
by Abiaka Windclan on Aug 14, 2011 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Other than potential $$$ or the super-conference apocalypse
I don’t see how this is beneficial to FSU at all.
Recruting really can’t get any better due to the name of their program, doesn’t matter what conference they’re in. They’re typically a top 5 or 10 recruiting team. What’s the difference between bringing in the #2 class or the #3 class every year? Not too big as long as you have coaching.
Also, how good of a shot do they really think they have at getting to a conference championship game in a division with UF, UGA, Tennessee, and USC? And I’m not even mentioning who they’d have to face from the other division in the championship. Heck, they’ve only made it twice in 6 years in a division with BC, Clemson, Maryland, NCSU, and Wake. I really think they have a much better shot at both a BCS game and a national title in the ACC than they do in the SEC.
I also think it’s funny how FSU fans think their poor program is getting treated sooo poorly by the big bad ACC and that’s why they should move. It’s not the ACC’s fault Bobby Bowden went senile. It’s not the ACC’s fault you let Wake Forest win the conference the year after you did with all that talent you have on your roster. It’s not the ACC’s fault that you only made the conference championship once when they had the freakin game IN YOUR OWN BACKYARD FIVE YEARS IN A ROW. They even put you and Miami in separate divisions (AND kept you separate from Virginia Tech!!) just so you guys could play each other in the championship game. Cut the victim act. Do you REALLY think the SEC is going to treat you much better, when they’d probably much rather cater to the needs of Bama, LSU, Florida, Auburn, Georgia, and (once they get their act together) Tennessee over you? Besides, if you’re going to complain about your difficult ACC schedule, just wait til you see your SEC schedule. I doubt all of your tough games will be followed by a trip to Vandy or Kentucky.
If FSU does for some unforesaken reason leave the ACC, I think it’s a lose-lose on both ends. The ACC loses one of its three best programs from a historical standpoint and FSU finds it harder to make it to the conference championship and a BCS game.
lose-lose
I agree it would be a lose-lose. To be honest I would prefer FSU to stay in the ACC. But for the mutual interest in the conference’s prosperity and that of the universities within something must be done in regards to competing with the new super-conferences. Swofford is sitting on the fence when the ACC should strike some deals and offer reassurance to the Universities that the schools won’t turn into a 4th or 5th best conference.
Right now I rate the ACC 4th behind Pac-12, B1G, and SEC in no order. If you look at each ACC schools payout.. we don’t stand a chance against the other three. If Swofford doesn’t do anything it will force FSU to do more than flirt with the SEC. Soo YES! It’s all about the $. And it doesn’t worry B.C. b/c your endowment is like 3 billion or something and FSU’s is a third or less in comparison.
I like this Conference
ACC North
Boston College
Connecticut
Syracuse
Rutgers
Pittsburgh
Virginia Tech
Virginia
Maryland
ACC South
North Carolina State
North Carolina
Wake Forest
Duke
Clemson
Georgia Tech
Florida State
Miami
It’s a great footprint: the 13 original colonies plus Florida. The footprint includes huge urban centers and TV markets that Auburn, Alabama—sorry, SEC—just can’t touch. It offers marquee value in all sports. It has a distinguished academic profile that could be built upon.
The SEC looks like a good move now because of recent success and short-term prospects. But an ACC like this is the kind of conference that would be a good home for the next 50-80 years.
If Swofford could put this together the contracts would be lucrative and it would be in the interest of every school named above to stay put. Let the SEC, Pac 12 and Big Ten+ fight over the scraps of the UTexas conference. More power to them.
It would be truly proactive if the phone calls have already been made and the understandings set over the last year. It would be great if the bids are all set to go out as soon as some other conference shoots the gun. The SEC invites Texas A&M and turns its eyes to Florida State… only to hear that four BE schools have now accepted bids to join the ACC and the Seminoles prefer to stay right where they are.
Abiaka Windclan
>>>----------------------->
by Abiaka Windclan on Aug 14, 2011 1:55 PM EDT reply actions
How does a 16-team conference work though? It’s clearly not an optimal football model. 10 is optimal (round robin, no title game), 12 is OK and 14 and 16 just gets really unwieldy.
7 games against your side of the division and 1 protected cross-over? 2? The schedule is extremely unbalanced and you would rarely face programs from the other side of the conference.
The 16-team model isn’t very stable (see the WAC circa 1997).
Editor, BC Interruption
Why 16?
The 16-team leagues everyone is talking about do work as basically two allied sub-conferences. Each division (sub-conference) would have a cohesive identity for the reason you say. The identity would be similar to the kind you get with a smaller conference (Pac-8, Big 10 when it was really 10, 1980s ACC, etc). The teams in your division are the teams you see the most because you need to play them and because they are closer to you geographically.
So why have a large conference with two divisions rather than two smaller conferences? Negotiating power with networks, conference championship games in football, and—if 16-team leagues become the norm—a true championship playoff in college football. Also, you reduce administration costs: one commissioner for 16 teams instead of two, common set of rules, etc.
An expanded ACC like the one I described above would be appealing in both football and basketball. The North and South divisions would mitigate some of the long travel times and expenses our (very vertical!) footprint entails. I like it academically, too. I count 8 AAU member schools there, with more on the way.
I thought a goal like this might be where the ACC was heading when it added Boston College, Virginia Tech and Miami. With everyone talking about 16-team leagues, I think it’s in ACC members’ best interest to decide what kind of league we want to build, and move toward that, rather than stand around and let shows drop farther west before reacting.
Abiaka Windclan
>>>----------------------->
by Abiaka Windclan on Aug 16, 2011 7:15 PM EDT reply actions
Still don't think 16 is practical
How does the football schedule work? Play seven divisional opponents and one team from the other side? Does that one game against the other side count towards the standings? That’s an incredibly unbalanced schedule and doesn’t really do a great job of determining a true conference champion.
Basketball scheduling is an equal nightmare. Ask the Big East. Syracuse and Georgetown are pissed they only get one meeting this year. Even with an 18-game schedule, you are guaranteed three home-and-homes. Otherwise with 16, just one home-and-home. Again, extremely unbalanced.
This doesn’t even speak to the mess that the Olympic sports would be, with 16 very different athletics departments deciding to participate in any number of Olympic sports. The ACC runs into this problem today with its joke of a four-team men’s lacrosse league and random numbered programs in different non-rev sports.
The WAC tried 16 in the late 1990s and didn’t last long due to the instability. I still don’t believe 16 across the board is an end game.
Editor, BC Interruption
This is too funny. BC telling the ACC that ...
losing Clemson, FSU or Miami wouldn’t hurt the conference! Poll the fans of the ACC and see whether they are ready to boot the Eagles out of the conference! You haven’t added anything to the ACC besides a great Matt Ryan hit in Death Valley and frequent flyer miles up the East Coast. What a joke. Get a real college baseball stadium and some fans to attend your bowl game and then you can join in on the conversation!
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on BC Interruption
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
