ACC Realignment Hypothetical: Adding Pittsburgh And West Virginia?
In a recent Southern Pigskin article, Derrick Stacy writes of the possibility of the ACC adding Pittsburgh and West Virginia to the conference, creating the nation's first super conference. Under this scenario, West Virginia and Pittsburgh would join Boston College, Virginia, Maryland and Duke in an ACC North Division, while North Carolina, N.C. State, Clemson, Miami, Florida State, Wake Forest and Georgia Tech would make up the ACC South.
The argument goes that West Virginia and Pittsburgh deliver the Pittsburgh TV market and makes sense geographically, which are the "two dominant aspects of conference expansion."
The Smoking Musket is loving this proposal, which would benefit WVU both financially and athletically:
"As far as I can see it, this move doesn't have a downside. The new ACC, while not quite as strong as the SEC in pigskin, would still be the second or third strongest conference in football (Big Ten has an argument for #2) and the strongest in basketball. It would bring a great deal more money into Morgantown and allow for West Virginia athletics to flourish across all platforms."
Sure, this is a sweetheart deal for West Virginia and Pittsburgh, but a move like this isn't nearly as feasible as the Southern Pigskin article would suggest.
First, the Pittsburgh TV market isn't as attractive as advertised. Pittsburgh is just the 22nd largest TV market in the country, and this would create a strange TV coverage map that includes existing ACC territories, western Pennsylvania and West Virginia. West Virginia adds next to nothing in terms of TV. The conference would then have to be able to renegotiate its existing TV contract and argue that the addition of Pitt and West Virginia would add at least $24 million per year to the value of the ACC media rights deal, lest every ACC program would be poorer with the additions. Even if the ACC were able to head back to the negotiating table with ESPN, few programs add that much value to these media rights deals to make it economically viable.
Second, and with due respect, West Virginia would be a huge academic drain on the conference. WVU would instantly become the least valuable institution in the ACC academically. Can you really see schools like Duke, North Carolina, Virginia and Wake Forest approving adding West Virginia to the fold? These schools nearly turned away BC in the last round of expansion talks, and would have also turned away Virginia Tech if it weren't for some late-hour Virginia General Assembly politics. Everyone is quick to point to athletic department revenues when it comes to conference musical chairs, but there is an equally large amount of money in bettering your academic standing. In doing so, a school can land more lucrative research grants and improve admissions, which produces more valuable alums, which become donors of the school, and so on and so forth ...
Finally, let's remember we are talking about John Swofford here, who has made it clear on multiple occasions he has no interest in taking a proactive stance on conference expansion and realignment. The ACC's most recent TV media rights contract gives the conference stability with 12 members. Barring an SEC raid of the conference's four southernmost members, the ACC has zero incentive to expand beyond its current configuration.
Yet apparently this move makes sense financially and geographically, so the conversation must be imminent!
"Due to the financial positives and the geographical feasibility, this conversation will soon be broached. When that occurs, the ACC will engage themselves in a game of conference chess. Will they make the intelligent and aggressive move, and attempt to gain a distinct advantage over the competition?"
Intelligent? No. Aggressive? Maybe, but this move isn't happening anytime soon. It doesn't make sense financially and we've seen in recent conference musical chairs that geography isn't high on the list of expansion criteria. But it's June, so us bloggers have nothing better to do than dream up fanciful conference expansion ideas that have less than a 1 percent chance of ever happening.
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Good point, when did geography become a criteria?
What does going to 14 members gain you and so what if you are first to that number. Both Pitt and WVU would still be around if the SEC raided the ACC, those two are not going anywhere.
Are you sure the BE teams will still be available?
Besides the BE the ACC is making the least amount of TV money of all the BCS conferences. The BE was offered 11.5 million dollars by ESPN a couple of months ago which they turned down. That is only 2.5 million less than the ACC and the BE can’t negotiate with other networks until a year from September. My point is if the ACC waits until next year the BE will probobly be making more money than the ACC. Not because they deserve it but because the ACC is stuck in a below market contract for the next 12 years. The Big 12 just signed a contract that pays them 4 million per year more than the ACC after they lost Nebraska and Colorado. If that happens the ACC isn’t plucking anyone from the BE.
We might not like to admit it but the ACC is in trouble.
by Silver Spring on Jul 27, 2011 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I think talking about TV money is hilarious
As the SEC has some of the worst TV markets, yet has the better TV deal. Little Rock, Starksville, Columbia, Lexington, Oxford, and all of Alabama are incredibly small markets. What do they have though? People. Those people travel lengthy miles to the games, they spend crap tons on athletic wear, and they always pack out their home stadiums, even if its a spring game. In my mind WVU brings that same attitude in it’s athletics. I can’t recall the last time they didn’t have a sell out. In the ACC, we struggle with getting people into the games. Wake, UNC, Duke, UVA, Maryland, & GT (unless UGA is playing in Atlanta that year) can barely have a passable attendance. WVU would add a regional rival to the northern schools schedules, bring its extremely well spread out fan base (you can find them from in Atlanta, Charlotte, Raleigh, Richmond, DC and Philly), and quality overall athletic department. It is something to consider.
On the topic of academics, you hit it right on the head. WVU lacks in this and is not a passable ACC school. One of the reasons I know that the ACC would never fall apart is that it is a conference based on academics & athletics. All 12 members have corresponding research ideals, and each is a leader in some level of academia. WVU doesn’t have that, but just like when Penn State joined the Big Ten, I think they can and would step up their game.
Any thoughts on my thoughts? I always like to hash out this. Oh and wondering why I didn’t say anything about Pitt? Because no one likes them, seriously, find me a die hard Pitt fan, and I’ll show you a guy that would rather be at a Penn State game.
Don't give up, don't ever give up ~ Jim Valvano
The value in the SEC is in the sum of its parts, not the individual schools when it comes to TV. They have superior football programs and can overcome their TV market disadvantages because they have a national TV deal between CBS and ESPN. It’s not about TV market size like it is for the Big Ten.
Whether or not you agree that West Virginia adds value on TV is moot based on the fact that the ACC already has a national TV media rights deal. The conference would need to renegotiate that contract and West Virginia would have to be worth $12 mil / year in added ratings, otherwise the other ACC programs would be poorer for it. WVU doesn’t add nearly that much value to a TV contract and that is after you clear the hurdle of getting ESPN back to the bargaining table in the first place.
BC Interruption, SBN's Boston College Eagles blog
“Due to the financial positives and the geographical feasibility, this conversation will soon be broached
I like speculation and broad assumptions based purely on nothing.
Contributor at BC Interruption
Founder of Mass Hysteria Sports
If TV money is the biggest consideration,
Then the ACC ought to be flirting with Temple and Rutgers. If it is interested in further improving the product on the field, then Pitt and WVU would be a nice addition.
Isn't that what the ACC tried to do with Miami, Va-Tech and BC?
Improve the product on the field? Expansion is done for one reason only, economic. Any other reason is hard to predict or control.
by ev on Jun 22, 2011 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Why the hate for WVU academics?
Brian@BCl, what concrete data do you have to support your contention and blanket accusation that:
“West Virginia would be a huge academic drain on the conference. WVU would instantly become the least valuable institution in the ACC academically.”
While I am in no way trying to argue that WVU is on the same level academically as Duke, UNC or UVA for example (or even your alma mater or NW, we’re all real impressed by the way, do you drink wine and have cheese at your tailgate parties?)
I can’t believe that we bring less to the academic table than the likes of NC State, Clemson, VaTech, or Fla. St.. No disrespect to those schools either. Did you have any concrete data or research to support your statements before you wrote your article or are you just subscribing to the worn out stereotype WVU must only have rednecks as students and is only a party school. It is true that WV is a poor state and WVU is poorly funded by the state but WVU ranks nationally for prestigious scholarships – 25 Rhodes Scholars, 21 Truman Scholars, 33 Goldwater Scholars, two British Marshall Scholars, two Morris K. Udall Scholars, five USA Today All-USA College Academic First Team Members (and 11 academic team honorees), eight Boren Scholars, five Gilman Scholars, three Department of Homeland Security Scholars, two Fulbright Scholars, and one Jack Kent Cooke Foundation Graduate Scholar.
So while I have no qualm with your argument based on the TV markets, I seriously doubt you wrote your article having done any real research on WVU’s academics. I just figure if for some reason the ACC was looking to add a school from the SEC it wouldn’t give a rat’s ass about that schools academics or TV markets. It would just see a rabid fan base and tradition.
wvbulldog94 — while you have every right to disagree with me and/or present a differing opinion, I do take offense to the accusation that I don’t do any research / homework when writing blog posts. If you’ve read any of my other posts here over the 3+ years I’ve been blogging at BCI, you’d find that I actually spend a lot of time on my posts.
Anyhow, here is your concrete data:
- West Virginia would be the least selective school in the ACC (+ other expansion candidates Pitt and Syracuse), accepting 88 percent of applicants. N.C. State has the second highest acceptance with 55%.
- WVU also retains the lowest percentage of freshmen (80%). Florida State runs second with a 89% retention rate.
- WVU’s 6-year graduation rate is 58 percent, 13 percentage points below Florida State’s 71% (currently worst in the ACC).
BC Interruption, SBN's Boston College Eagles blog
US News n World Report ranking
FSU # 104
NCSU. # 111 (worst in ACC)
Clemson # 64
VaTech # 69
Where would WVU be??? Close to our bottom feeder? Nope not even close. It is 65 schools below the ACC worst at, drum roll please-
- 176. Yuk! 145 schools below BC. 167 schools below Duke
I thought
WVU and Pitt were proud of the BE.
Now the fans want join BC in the ACC. Guess they know BC made the right move.
Nice idea
But why? B/c they were almost previously invited? I like the idea but wonder if there is a shred of info to support the claim? Plus they say they really luvt he BE!!!
Did these guys feel left out or something? In all the ACC/Big10 expansion talk,when did Pitt or WVU ever come into the coversation? While I’m fine with 12 conference members, I sure wish ‘Cuse was in there with us. Anyway to trade WF or NCSU for ’Cuse and Rutgers? I’m only half kidding
by chicagofire1871 on Jun 23, 2011 2:25 AM EDT reply actions
I don't think adding more private schools to the conference will be done anytime soon
So Syracuse will more than likely be on the back burner. And I think the ACC learned it’s lesson about going after schools from big markets, as those schools don’t necessary carry the market. Syracuse might bring a small slice of the NYC market, but I don’t see it capable of holding over most it. I can say this assuredly that the ACC will never touch Rutgers with a 10 foot pole, as that university would not add much to the equation.
I still believe any new expansion will be after getting fan bases, as hopefully by now the conference has learned that the true driving force behind any successful “expansion” is people.
Don't give up, don't ever give up ~ Jim Valvano
First and foremost, expansion has to make sense financially via the conference’s revenue streams (chief among them, its TV media rights deal). Rabid fan bases are nice and all, but they don’t do much for the conference’s bottom line. WVU is a very regional school that doesn’t hold a lot of interest nationally.
Private schools may not draw well at the gate, but schools like Miami and BC do very well on TV.
BC Interruption, SBN's Boston College Eagles blog
PLEASE leave Tudor in. As someone in North Carolina who hears about his drivel all the time he’s unbearable. He loves UNC (a mortal sin) and is just so uninformed and biased it’s intolerable.
Blogger So Dear
"Meet me on the Quad at midnight" Skip Prosser
Haha. I’m glad to see another ACC fan shares our dislike for the guy.
BC Interruption, SBN's Boston College Eagles blog
by Brian Favat on Jun 28, 2011 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions

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